לגרסא העברית לחץ כאן – For the Hebrew version, click here
Hello Stephanos Dedas, the head coach of Hapoel Holon. how are you doing? How are holding on in the Corona isolation without the family? What are you doing when you are not with the team?
Since I first came, except the first weeks, after every practice I go to the office and discuss with my assistants about the practice and everything, later we have to be at home and we try to follow the instructions and minimize any movement so basically my routine is going to the stadium, practice, office and that's it. For us foreigners it's a difficult season but we have to adjust until the situation comes back to normal. However, we have an opportunity to record our practices, we try to work a lot in this preparation period.
Let's start with the previous season, with the Corona league. The rumors say that you didn't want to be forced to go to isolation both in Israel and in Greece without your family for such a long time, and the team that was built wasn't strong anyway. Is this the reason why you haven't came back? Whose decision was it?
First, when the league stopped in March, we were in great shape. The team won both at home and away, we were in the 4th place and the first thought when the league stopped is that we progressed a lot if you compare the first day that I arrived, watching from the stands the team getting defeated by Haifa, to the last game which was a home win again Rishon Lezion – it's like day and night.
We didn't believe that the league would resume because 90% of the leagues and competitions in Europe were stopped, so we tried to do the right thing and come to an agreement with all the players, especially the foreigners, and terminate their contracts so the team would have no debts and to start preparing for the new season. By finish at 4th place we got the ticket to this season's Fiba Champions League, and we felt that my arrival was successful because this was the goal. If the league wouldn't have stopped and we had the same roster and shape, we could have made great things and fight for the championship title. But this was the situation.
As far as the Corona league, the team already paid the players and we didn't have the budget to continue, other teams didn't payed their players, they waited to see what would happen.
So my decision not to come was among others due to the double isolation in Israel and Greece, but also people don't know that I gave up on a very big amount of my salary and I saved money for the club, and the club was able to bring 4 new foreign players for the Corona league in the difficult situation where there was no income. This is the story, it's a combination of reasons.
How involved were you in the Corona league team that was built? both in the building stage and during the league itself. Have you closely followed the team from afar?
I watched all the games but it's difficult to be involved from distance, I gave some advices to Sherf especially against Galil in the crucial game but I didn't interfere so much because of the distance.
Before that we talked with the players to convince them to come with a minimal salary, almost for free, just to help the team finish the league. We knew we had 6 tough games against Maccabi, Jerusalem and Rishon Lezion, the target was to be competitive in the quarter final series. We lost 2:1 in a close series against Galil but we knew that nobody would remember this Corona league anyway 2 weeks after. This was not the real Holon.
A new season, you are finally building the team on your own, tell us your feelings.
So far I think that people can be satisfied with me, starting from last year when I bought Mani Harris that became one the best players in the league, so I proved that I can bring good players in a good price to Holon. As far as this season, it was not so easy to build the team… The budget was reduced by tens of precents because there is no crowd, but for me it was not so important, I just had to fight more to try to bring players in lower price, I had long conversations with all the players.
My first priority was to keep T.J. Klein who was the best player for me and since I came he improved a lot, but we couldn't do it because he attracted a lot of interest and he signed a good contract with Brecia. So that was the first big problem, I started to think about other options.
There were some uncertainty with Pnini, Yogi and Shlomi, there was some negotiation to see if they stay and of they accept a pay cut, it was difficult to start building without knowing who would be the Israeli players, because of their special status. So first I wanted to finish with the Israeli and then in 1 week I tried to convince the foreign players to come to play for me.
My idea was first to bring 2 combo-guards that can handle the ball, score and shot, but I wasn't looking for a pure point guard because of Ohayun, to leave some space for him to be a main player. So we brought McGee and C.J Harris, 2 player with different characteristics: McGee is more physical, more athleticism, a stronger player and Harris is more talented and use more intelligence than athleticism. One complete the other.
After that I wanted to bring an Israeli player that can play in multiple positions, so I decided to bring Willy Workman who has energy which is great for the fans, he fights and knows the league. My teams have a lot of shooters, but we also need some guys to do the dirty job like Workman.
Then we wanted to cover the big-man position with Israelis because I don't think we have the luxury to have a foreign player in that position, because player in position number 5, a center, covers only this position and we need foreigners that can cover 2 or 3 positions every time. So we prefer to bring back Rich Howell to force him to play better than the last season. I think it's a good idea because he has to prove and show that he is much better than what you saw in Holon in last season. Based on his motivation we brought him back.
Then we had to bring 2 more foreign players, one in positions 4-5 to replace T.J Klein, Isaiah Miles who is a big man than that can shoot and play at position number 4, and occasionally to play as a stretch-five position, which correspond to my philosophy to spread the players in the perimeter, and of course I needed one more player at positions 3-4 with a good shot and good energy like Chris Johnson who knows the league. We also sign Trocki who showed good things in the Corona League and Oded Brandwein to help us with his experience if we need a few minutes, and this is how we built the team and the 10 players roster. It was hard to build with very difficult financial conditions, but I tried to do everything to convince them to come with low salaries. Generally, the summer was busy started with the Israelis, and then findings the right guys who feel hungry, and wanted to have a good season so they can act strongly in the players market in the next time.
This season the budget is lower due to Shlomo's leaving, what are the team's goals this season? Are there the same as last season?
In my opinion it's not the final place you should aim for, it doesn't give you anything if you put a goal to be first or third, it's not important. The important thing is what are you going to do on the court. This is what I said to the management and to the players. We will fight in all of the games, we have the quality to make a good season in the Israeli league and in the Champions league, so my targets are always short terms. It doesn't matter what I say about the goals, what's important is what we do on the court. All the fans knows I'm a fighter that would try to win all games as much as possible, and this is our goal: to have a fighting team, to enjoy and even if we have a bad game or we lose, we'll never loose easily, we will fight till the very last ball.
Well, I'm not going to ask you about the goals in the Fiba champions league, but what do you have to say about our rivals, AEK Athens, Cholet and Minsk? What are the chances to promote to the next stage?
The fact the team have never qualified for the next stage in the BCL, this is a big motivation for me. We have 6 games, the group stage is shorter. AEK is very strong, Cholet is an experienced French team and Minsk doesn't have big names, but it's an experienced VTB team which is always dangerous. AEK looks favorite to finish in the first place because we saw that they are a very strong team (finished second overall in the current season – G.C), and there is one additional spot that we compete for with Cholet and Minsk. We and Cholet have equal chance to finish in the 2nd place and qualify, so the first game against Cholet is very important. We need to win or to lose by a small margin that we can cover in the next game in Holon, hopefully when the fans would be back. This would give us a big advantage to qualify. I see it as 2 halves: one half in Cholet, the other half in Holon. We would also fight with AEK for sure, and for sure we need to beat Minsk at home in the 3rd game, but we need a good result in Chole. I'll try to do everything in order for the team to quality and do something that were never done before.
How would the new Hapoel holon look like this season, in terms of playing style? What would be the difference from the previous season when you didn't build the team? Will it be a small-ball team like was mentioned in the "Purple Voice" podcast?
Partially we will play with small ball, which is my philosophy, but for me small ball doesn't mean that you don't have size. If we have 5 players who are very good shooters and they spread across the perimeter all over the floor, it doesn't matter that we will be small. Johnson, Pnini and Workman are 3 guys that can be part of this lineup that have good size and experience to cover for it. Our roster has good size although we don't have a heavy center. I rather give space to McGee, Harris and Ohayun – quick guards that would have the space to attack the basket.
We are going to have 2 styles: One pick-and-roll with Howell, and the other with Miles who will player similarly to last year when we played with Klein at position number 5. This is how I play all the years, and this how I got my teams to be the top scoring teams in Turkey, in Israel and also in Greece before.
We will try to cover the size with big forwards, we saw in the practice games that this method works very well, we won in 2 out of the 3 games and lost only against Maccabi in the last ball, although they used all of their foreign players. I believe this is going to work.
Are we going to see more 3 pointer shots than rebounds or 2 points shots this season?
Every game is different. 3 points or 2 points shots – it always something that we can discuss. Burgos Basketball won the BCL title shooting for 3 points twice the time compared to 2 points shots in the final. The 3 points shot is something that helps you to have a very good look for 2 points shots. My philosophy is to try to spread the opponent's defense with shooters, and to give space to go to the basket for 2 points shot. So for us, our low-post actions are mostly penetration of the guards, that they have all the space to attack all the way.
What's important for me is to have open-looks for 3 point shots, and open 2 points layups. I don't like mid-range game, I don't like the difficult 2 points shots, an open 3 points shots have much more percentage to go in compared to a difficult 2 points shot. My style looks like there are a lot of 3 points shots but it is very balanced and you can see from the percentage of the 2 points shots – not many 2 points shots, but always a very high percentage, because we always try to go with the open looks.
So you tell me that eventually we are going to see you throw a 3 point shot with an open look.
Yeah, I can score but from half court, I'm better from half court.
Why have you chosen Howell over Alexander?
First, financially Joe was expecting a much higher salary than that we can afford, and second I think that Howell is a better creator, a better passer as a big-man, he is more a team player than Joe. Joe is a great player, more aggressive, can do more in the paint and can also shoot, but he not the guy who would try to make good passes and make his team-mates better. In my style I don't want every-time the same player to score, I want that each time someone else to be the leader and this would work only if you have players that pass the ball, to find the right player on the right day. So for this type of philosophy, Howell is better and also financially it was a better deal.
Is the building stage finished? Is this the final team?
No, the team would be finished then Holon's fans would come back. It's our last transfer and this would be more important than any kind of American or additional player for me, we still miss our best player. It is very difficult for this team to play without any crowd. It important for every team but for us, you know better – it's something exceptional. The DNA of the team is the fans of Holon, Holon without the fans is not Holon. One of the reasons I signed in this team is the fans, and the fact that we start the season without them, makes my job more difficult.
You are a loyal coach that tends to stay in the same team for years. However, you signed only for half a season when you came, and when the management liked what you have to offer and offered you a new contract. Many coaches don't want to come in the middle of the season, let alone sign for only half a season… So how come you agreed on this?
In my last 3 teams, Saint Petersbourg, Gazeintap and Bahçeşehir, I extended my contract 2 or 3 times each time. I try to be loyal to the club, and I want to prove myself on the court. I'm not a coach who want to hide behind the contract and put the club in a difficult position if they don't like me or I don't like them. I don't believe in papers and in insisting on a contract, I believe in the job on the court. This is what I discussed with the management in the last season, I said let's work for a few months and if you like, I will stay. Why to sign a 2 years contract when we don't know each other? Let win together and this would happen automatically – and this is what happened. The same things happened in the new contract: it' a 1-year contract and if we will be happy we'll continue. Eventually I stay more if I do this compared to signing a contract for 2 or 3 years in the beginning. If you proove yourself you continue.
We are also happy that you are staying for at least another season. You were the head coach in Turkey and an assistant in Slovenia, Russia and of course Greece, how would you compare the Israeli league to other leagues?
There are a lot of similarities between the Israeli league and the Turkish league. The focus of the teams is to try to sign good scorers, so is what determines the chemistry of the team. The playing style is also similar. Also in both countries it's important to bring good domestic players, because foreigners alone is not enough. The difference is that here in Israel the passion and atmosphere is better. In Turkey a lot of times you see empty courts except the derbies between the Istanbul teams. In Israel every game is very electric and very intense, a lot of rivalries between the teams…
It's a little bit like in Greece, no?
Yeah but that was in Greece in previous years, now in Greece the crowd calmed down of the financial situation, we see only a few strong teams besides Panathinaikos and Olympiacos that can make a competitive league. For example, the best team besides of them now is Promitheas, and you don't see crazy fans because they don't have this tradition like you have here.
Here it is more stable and balanced. You never had a lot of money, but during a crisis you don't feel that the budget goes down, the league keeps its quality and financial level when all the other leagues go down. Also teams don't sign players that they cannot pay for, unlike in Turkey when they sign big contracts and afterward they owe money and won't pay. The financial stability is a big difference.
What are your future ambitions and goals? Where would you be in 3-4-5 years from now?
My next step when I finish this term in Holon, is to try to be an assistant coach in a Euroleague team. This is the one thing you must do if you want to be a Euroleague coach. It's very difficult for a Euroleage team to trust a coach from the BCL level. I'm still young, I'm 38 – one of the youngest in Europe, and I know I have the best resume and profile in Europe among coaches under 40 years old. So I have time to invest in myself. After that – I'll see which level I can be in as a head coach.
This is my plan, but you can never know, you cannot really plan in basketball: Maybe I go and be the head coach of another team, maybe I'll stay here forever… It's very difficult to plan ahead, coaches cannot plan whatever they want. It's an uncertain job, not an easy job, you cannot do whatever you want but you need to have goals. If I'll have a good season in Holon, I can look ahead at the next step. My goal and the team's goal is to first be a compensative team. If the team would fight every day, try to win and we'll have a good atmosphere, this would help not only to Holon but also to my reputation in the market. But at the moment, I don't know what would happen in 2 or 3 years, the most important thing for me know is to have a good season with Holon – one thing would bring the other things.
Maybe Holon would be a Euroleague team… no? Not a chance, ah?
This would be ideal, but the Euroleague is a closed club, it doesn't matter if you take the championship title… If Holon wants to change levels, you must have more investors. We had Shlomo who was a bit alone and didn't receive a lot of help, he couldn't continue supporting the team in the same way, now we have a group of other people trying to help the team… Holon have the right jerseys, the right fans, the right stadium – everything, but not enough money.
What do you have to say to Israeli coaches that are worried about the trend of foreign coaches that "take their spot" allegedly?
Look, I was a foreign coach in Turkey same as here. I think that the teams are private companies, if the owner who pays money like in Holon or Maccabi, wants to sign a foreign coach because he believe this coach has more quality, he have the right to do so. On the other hand, I can ask why do the Israeli coaches don't you sign only Israeli players? because they don't have enough quality. So they take Americans, 4 foreigners and 3-4 "passport guys" who just became citizens, Americans with Jewish roots that sometimes don't even speak Hebrew. The owners have the same right, they also want more options as with foreign coach, you have plenty of options.
When the Israeli coaches would want to sign only Israeli players, then they would have the right to complaint about foreign coaches. Then I would agree with them. Bottom line: the teams are private companies with high goals and investments, so they do what's better for their clubs.
But you know, I'm used to difficulties. Israel is a much more friendly country for a Greek than Turkey, the Israelis like Greeks, Greek music, vacations, so it's not such a difficult environment for me. But I was in Turkey for 7 years and survived there although Greece and Turkey are not the best friends, so for me difficulties are part of my life. I can honestly tell you that also in Greece I'm a kind of a foreigner, because I didn't work there for the last 10 years, so even if I go back I would be treated a little bit different, like an outsider. Sometimes you are a foreigner everywhere, but it's OK, this is part of the job.
Before we finish, tell us something that the fans do not know about you, something that would surprise them.
Mmmm… They know I'm a little bit emotional and little bit crazy, this is something that they know for sure because they see me…
We like it.
They probably don't know that outside of the court I can be a very funny guy… I like to have good time with my staff, we go out, to hang out with my colleagues, to talk about games and watch other games, I'm a different person outside of the court. In the court I'm an aggressive coach, I'm attacking the players, I fight for every position from my side, but outside of the court I'm a completely different person.
In a matter of fact, I heard about it and I expected to laugh a bit during the interview which was very serious – but no complaints there…
You know, sometimes when I go out in Holon sometimes the fans see me and they call me to drink a shot of Arak together, they yell Yalla Holonia – it's nice. It's a nice feeling for people to recognize that you put a lot of effort for the team. One additional thing that everyone should know is that I'm a natural guy, I'm not a fake and not putting an act, I'm a really emotional guy and I have a lot of passion for my job, this is my character. The reason that I'm currently happy is that my basketball DNA had a very good fit with Holon.
Fans don't care how you are going to play, they want you to fight and try to win in any way – by kicking, by attacking, by yelling… For sure we need the quality, but what I like and respect in the fans is that they want to see the team fight. In the first day when I just came the fans told me: coach, we don't care if we are going to lose in every game, we want to see the team fight in every game, this is what we care about. And I saw that when we lost a game that we fought the fans appreciated it so it actually happened.
On the other hand, before I came, the team was defeated hands-down against Haifa, Nahariya in the Cup, Rishon leZion… Fans were not satisfied because the team didn't fight. Eventually in basketball you are not alone on the court, but fighting is not about a specific day or a specific opponent, fighting is something you need to have in the team's DNA, and for this reason I'm happy that I'm here.
One thing that I can promise to the fans is that we fight in every game, we will try to combine quality with fighting to get the wins. The fans would never be unsatisfied with the way the team fight.
Maybe we are going to lose in some of the games, we'll lose in games we didn't expect, we'll win tight games that were supposed to be big wins – this is all part of the season, we are going to play 50 games it's normal to have a bad period and maybe loose a couple of games in a row, there would be a lot of ups and downs, it happens in every team, but I can promise that we'll always fight and talk about basketball, not about why we won't fight. We will fight, this is not negotiable. We will fight and try to do our best to make the fans happy.
Last question, anything else you want to add?
I would like to use this opportunity of the interview to thank that previous management, especially Shlomo who was the guy who brought me here, we are still in contact and have good communication, so I want to thank him for bringing me to Holon. I also want to the thank the current management who was also part of the previous management, Eitan, Roy and Mickey, I appreciate both management for the trust they gave me, and I'm sure that the management would be happy with my effort every day on the court.
Thank you very much for your time!
Toda raba!